Thanks for all those that responded, I assumed it was a scam, the timing through me. Anyway little can be done till Wednesday and as the package is comming from the Midlands, England it will very likely be here then. Matt from UKtrainsim in the past has always sent these things by Royal Mail. I understand the problem of offtopic threads on the net but I believe one should be able to discuss important sensible issues with out being forced to listen to stuff one has no interest in. Luv has very strongly put its position so in the end I am gone. The post was a genuine query but I will admit it was an "agent provacteur" (or how ever you spell that) to see if something like this would occur, after the incedent with the speaker thread late last year a friend said "What are you doing with a technical group that forbids certain technical topics, thats not like you". I simply disagree with the rules of the group so in the end thats it. Lindsay